I think we are in need for additional option to add scroller genre (example: Astro Menace). I am going to add several games of this genre.
mhm to what?
is shoot them up enough or doe we need to ad scrolling...?
for me scrolling is rather unspecific as a category.
I think scroller is more concrete. I saw typical 3D shooters added in category "shoot them up". It is just not obvious what belongs there.
yes, agreed, its not obvious. But this can only be changed with proper category descriptions.
A lot is still missing and something needs more detail.
i am willing to revisit the game taxonomy if we can agree on the major idea of game genres.
we could base the genres on wikipedia:
I have added some messages on problematic categories here: http://www.lgdb.org/forums/lgdb/games
If you give me rights to correct the categories I can do much myself. It seems it is actually mess now.
I agree we can use Wikipedia.
I suggest the following in short:
1. RPG - player controls hero/hero's spacecraft, upgrades, manages inventory, buys things. Available inventory is very diverse and/or unique (not just medkit). Quests and experience.
- MMORPG - online RPG with prolonged game time (at least several days)
- Dota-like (Heroes on Newerth)
- Dungeons (single-player)
2. Strategy - player controls units and sometimes base/buildings, units are produced/bought during the game
- City building/economic (Railroad tycoon, Sim City, Caesar III, Settlers, Hospital, Tropico etc) Building/buying roads and utilities, trade, selling goods. Goods chains. Events (disasters, recession). Distinguishing feature - units usually not controlled directly. The player only builds buildings, roads.
- 4X - subgenre of strategy. extended diplomacy, technology tree, research. technology is based on research rather than buildings. exchange of technologies with other factions, spying. unique projects. extensive colonization is essential to win.
3. Adventure - storyline is based on puzzles. Player uses text/conversation to advance the storyline. Sometimes have to find hidden items. Gameplay is divided into distinct locations between which the player can move. The graphics may be static. No fight.
4. Platformer - you jump from one floor to another, use stairs, open chests. Can jump on the clouds etc. Avoid stationary turrets and guns.
5. Shoot'em up/scroller. New and new enemies appear, you stay at place or the screen scrolls. Move usually in one direction. Each level ends with a boss. Two subgenres: with flyings and with beatings. Differs from platformer in that you cannot move back.
6. Simulation. You drive a vehicle or aircraft, very realistic. Economic simulation does not belong here.
7. Shooter - descendants of Wolfenstain 3D. Usually first-person. You see your own hand with a weapon.
8. Racing - you shell win a race.
9. Casual (including board and card games as well as Tetris, Lines, Arcanoid, Python, maze, pipes etc). Manipulation of abstract objects.
I think Shoot'em up/scroller should be two separate and distinct categories. I also don't agree that Adventure should have no fight.
> I think Shoot'em up/scroller should be two separate and distinct categories.
How would you distinguish them?
> I also don't agree that Adventure should have no fight.
Typically has no fight or fight is unimportant, otherwise it is a mix of genres. But what's your definition then?
Anixx good list and from what you wrote i think its best to NOT have genre and subgenre but just one taxonomy. in know some categories are only used in combination with others e.g. 4x can only be a startegy game, but that gives us more flexibility.
e.g. for adventure: if a game has the category adventure it should have no fighting, but if it has adventure and action (an action-adventure) it can have combat.
we will not have a separate description of action-adventure but probably a small info in the adventure description.
A separate category "shooter" very important.
the category "arcade" has to go, a lot games in that category will be in the casual category.
@anixx why should simulation not include economic simulation if economy is selected as a second category?
i just outline the changes from the existing categorization scheme:
first person shooter -> first person
tactical shooter -> tactical
EDIT: it took me to long to write this comment and anixx posted inbetween, sorry.
> why should simulation not include economic simulation if economy is selected is a second category?
I think that difference between economic simulation and, say, vehicle simulation is too much, completely different genres. Besides, economic simulation is not simulation in the true meaning (did you see a true stock exchange simulation anywhere?). The games which called "economic simulators" are usually just themed strategies with emphasis on economy.
Simulation as I perceive should be realistic. That is driving or other activity with all realism and as such, difficult. In flying simulator you shell know how to drive an actual plane, in railroad simulation - how to drive a train, in space simulator - how to make approach to another spacecraft etc. Simulators are useful in training stuff.
That is openBVE, Rigs of Rods, Palomino are simulators.
> tactical shooter -> tactical
what should go into this genre?
i agree with you but i think people usually expect that "tycoon" or city building games to be in the simulation category rather than being called strategy games.
i think the difference between those to genres can be summed up to: Strategy games have one or more human or AI controlled opponents, simulation games don't.
tactical shooters have objective and team oriented game-play.
If you take Railroad Tycoon, there are fully-featured AI opponents with the same rights as yours. They own trains, plants, mines, roads, buildings, stations. In Caesar III there are also opponents. Though they have no city (but can have villages), they can attack yours. In Settlers the same. In Tropico rebels can initiate a revolt so you have to have army to shoot them.
What unites these games is that the units usually not controlled, maybe except in the battle. They act by their own, but you can assign certain task to them which they will do in a cycle. You can hire and fire individual units, sometimes see their mood, what they think, how they are happy, where they are going, what they want. In Tropico you even can see for whom they voted, if they are party or trade-union leaders, what is their education.
What also is important is that you keep eye on the roads so they were not overcrowded by traffic and different locations are reachable. This is a common problem for all these games.
I suggest to call it "city building" or "economic siulation". But it is a distinct genre of driving simulators.
mhm... i wouldnt have thought settlers to be a simulation game but wikipedia does:
i guess it comes down to this:
Do we make our own categories or do we stick with what wikipedia says?
One just should understand that it is not simulation in the same meaning as Rigs of Rods.
It is a game which belongs to the same category as Caesar, Tropico, Sim City, Imperium Romanum, Theme Hospital, Railroad Tycoon. Thus it is simulation in the same meaning as Sim City. You build roads, hire/invite stuff (in Caesar, Tropico, and Sim City they immigrate) say them what to do. They do the assigned tasks while you just keep an eye on the traffic, food and the queues. And account the profits. Usually there are chains of goods: you use some goods to produce others, more expensive (Caesar, Tropico, Settlers, Railroad Tycoon). In Hospital there are chains of services.
settlers is mix between rts and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Construction_and_management_simulation or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_simulation_game
Quote - Manufacturer's Description
The Settlers II is a strategy-laden economic simulation and the follow up to the hugely successful Settlers. Your objectives in this highly addictive game will be to promote economic growth and prosperity. Your tasks will include the mining of raw materials, farming, hunting and fishing. You will also be encouraged to trade with the inhabitants of remote islands.